Getting started with O/A

[jimgood]

I guess my new process for getting tanks will be to bring my regulators and check the fit before I leave.

Incidentally, I tried to edit my first post to add this useful tidbit but it looks like I can no longer edit that post. Maybe there's a time limit on that.

[jimgood]

Here is the bird barrier project I mentioned a few posts ago. The first pic below shows the problem I'm trying to solve. These big doors stay open when the weather is warm and birds fly in and start building their nests in the eaves. I wouldn't mind this but they are not potty trained. The second picture shows the inside of the same door. I made some brackets from which the barrier frame will hang. The 3rd picture is a closeup of the hanger brackets.

The fourth pic is the frame of the barrier. It's 11' 11" wide by 7' 8" high. I still have to add another frame to the top that will close in the gap at the top of the door frame. The frame will hang from the round tubing welded to the top (5th pic) which will sit loosely in the hanger brackets. The idea is to attach chicken wire to this frame. I plan to use small pieces of 1" wide plate with self taping screws to clamp the chicken wire to the frame at various points.

As far as the welding is concerned, I learned a lot. First, I had concerns about how I was going to keep such a large project level. I took advantage of the posts in the overhang of our barn and temporarily attached a 2 x 8 x 12'. Then I placed the saw horses parallel and leveled them by moving the gravel under them. It didn't take much. This kept the top and bottom frame pieces aligned with one another.

I know the welds aren't the prettiest, but they're strong enough. This is all 1" square or round tubing of 1/16" thickness. I mitered the corners to get the strongest possible joints. After discussion here and doing some more research, I realized that I had been using way too much acetylene pressure. I found one reference that talked about how the flame should sound. My flame had been sounding like a jet engine and was causing overheated, oxidized welds. For butt joints, I started using a quiet flame, just hissing, and worked it closer to the weld.

For joints that were 90 degrees or so I found that, before, I was using too little flame and getting in too close, causing a lot of backfiring. Once I switched to using an angrier flame and backed it off from the weld a little more I was able to get a better weld. It was tricky because this thin metal would burn through on one side of the joint easily. I burned holes in three or four places that I later had to fill in. I was never able to get the pool to form in the crease. It was always two pools on either side then I used filler to join the two pools.

To maximize the strength of the joint between the round tube (hinge) and the top of the frame, I tacked the round tube at each end, then I laid a piece of 1/2" x 1/8" bar along the tube so that one edge was along the middle of the of the tube and the other edge was along the top edge of the frame (5th pic). I used a hotter flame and focused most of the heat along the edge of the bar, pushing its pool together with the smaller pool formed on the adjacent part. I also used filler to ensure plenty of metal in the joint.

Because the frame is so large, I didn't want move it at all until I had all the joints completely welded. This meant I had to lay on my back and weld upside down on the bottom of each joint. That was interesting to say the least. I was concerned about molten metal dripping down onto me, but I found that the weld pool stayed in place very well.

One more thing I learned was that I was using too much oxygen in my welds (along with too much acetylene pressure). Some of my welds were bubbling and sparking a lot. Once I backed the pressure down and was more careful about how much oxygen I was adding to get a "neutral" flame, things got much better. A side benefit is that I'm using much less oxygen. I emptied my oxygen tank much faster than my acetylene before. Now it's just the opposite.

[Hotrod1932]

Well Jim Birds or no Bird them welds are starting to look GOOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Like a wise old man that helped me lean what little I know about welding once told me, if it works take the credit! if it breaks or fails down the line, just shrug your shoulders and say " Well I know the welder " and leave it at that!

Nice job!

[jimgood]

Thanks, Ray! I'm definitely starting to feel more comfortable with it. I should have it all figured out by the time I start on the second one.

[jimgood]

Here is the bird barrier nearly finished. I'll try to get a better pic up tomorrow that shows some of the details.

This frame is covered on the outside with chicken wire. I used 1"x3" pieces of 1/16" bar with self-tapping screws to clamp the wire in place and supplemented it with zip ties.

There are four things left to do. I need to mount a pulley system to raise the frame when I need to get the tractor in and out. I have all the parts, I just need to work up the courage to get up on a ladder in the rafters to mount it. Sixteen feet isn't very high, but it's just about at the maximum height for my ladder and it's very shaky. I also need to mount some hooks on the side of the frame to hold it against the wall at the bottom (it's sprung out about two inches). There are gaps at the top and bottom that need to be filled in. I'll do that with some 2" x 2" wood. The last thing is to mount a loop on the bottom of the frame. This is where the pulley hook will attach. I already forged a loop (basically an upside down "U") from some 1/4" round bar. I just coated it with Penetrol and, once it's dry, I'll screw it on with the self-tapping screws.

I still have to repeat the process for the door on the west wall. That one I'm going to fit between the posts instead of flat against the inside of the posts like this one. I intended to do that with this one, but I screwed up when I was measuring and, once I welded the frame together, I figured I'd mount it this way instead of cutting it apart and redoing it.

All in all, I think it came out pretty good. I wanted it to be as unobtrusive as possible.

I have a lot of time into this. I think the frame took about 10 hours to cut, fit and weld. The small pieces, like the hanger brackets took about six hours. The biggest waste was fixing miter cuts that weren't correct. I bought a DeWalt cutoff saw with the carbide blade thinking it would save some time because it cuts so cleanly but blade deflection is a significant problem. It's also difficult to cut small pieces like those for the hanger brackets. Painting took about 4 hours, but had to be done over two weeks to wait for warm spells. Hanging the chicken wire took about 5 hours. About half of that time was trial and error. Now that I know how to do it, it'll take half that time. So, 25 hours altogether but I think I can cut that time in half for the next one.

[jimgood]

The pulley above the barrier frame needs to hang between two of the ceiling trusses above the door. My original idea was to just screw a piece of 1" sq. x 48" tubing across them and hang the pulley from that. It doesn't have to hold much weight. But I decided to over engineer it and the result is below. The angle brackets on the ends are actually two pieces of flat bar welded together. The tubing is 2" square 1/8".

I learned yet another thing the hard way. DON'T QUENCH WELDED PIECES IN WATER!! I quenched the left end and it hardened to the point that I was unable to drill the screw holes. I ate up three titanium drill bits before I realized what the problem was. I ended up using the torch to cut the holes. The right end was fine because it cooled on its own while I was welding the left one.

[Iron_Canvas]

This was a great thread, I just read the whole thing and I feel like I learned a lot. Do you have any pointers for guys who are like you were when you first posted this thread?

[Hotrod1932]

Joe best advice I can give ya when you start learning to weld is :

"If you smell something burning, stop and put yourself out!"

[jimgood]

Originally Posted by Iron_Canvas

This was a great thread, I just read the whole thing and I feel like I learned a lot. Do you have any pointers for guys who are like you were when you first posted this thread?

Hmmm...pointers.

1. Research the various welding processes and figure out what will work for the type of welding projects you want/need to do right now. I think most people will find that the projects they want to start on will involve fairly thin metals (usually 1/8" or thinner).
2. Read a book and watch a few videos on welding (there are many on youtube). That will get your brain prepared for the process overall.
3. Get the best equipment you can afford but don't waste precious learning time waiting until you can afford the "Cadillac". If all you can afford right now is the "Corolla", get it and start welding. I waited several years and still ended up getting the "Corolla". I could have spent that time developing my skills instead of thinking about it.
4. I find cutting cleanly and accurately with Oxy/Acetylene is far more difficult than welding. Invest in good cutting tools or expect to waste a lot of time and metal.
5. The welding equipment itself is only part of the expense. You need to invest in clamps; lots and lots of clamps. A good welding book will help. Even if it doesn't provide a list of the necessary tools, it will describe processes and, in doing so, will imply the use of tools and materials. Where it says "bevel the edge" of a piece of metal, translate that into asking yourself, do I have the tool to do that?
6. Start with projects that aren't going to get someone killed if your welds aren't perfect.
7. Practice. Just do it. But practice smartly. Metal expands and shrinks when you weld it. If you welded a miter joint, did it hold its angle as it cooled? I learned about distortion the hard way building rectangular frames. Did your weld penetrate completely through? Cut your practice pieces and find out. Is it different welding inside a corner vs. outside? Pay attention to little things like your torch angle, movement and distance from the metal and how that affects the weld.
8. Check around your local area for guys willing to help out. When I was struggling with my first practice welds, I had our farrier look at the torch flame I was using. The shape of the flame was perfect but I was using too much fuel causing a roaring flame that was blowing metal away. I reduced the fuel and bingo! I could control the weld pool.
9. Enjoy the journey. When something doesn't go exactly how you expected it to, laugh about it, learn from it and move on.

Good luck!

[Stretch]

Originally Posted by jimgood

...

1. Read a book and watch a few videos on welding (there are many on youtube). That will get your brain prepared for the process overall.

...

Which book helped you?