PLEASE...Post weld to finished seam

[Dick Bear]

Hey

This is addressed to the experts in creating invisible seams between panels.

Could you, would you please explain your procedures, tricks, techniques in addition to any other information you feel important for completing a welded seam between panels FOLLOWING the weld in BOTH steel and Aluminum.

In the past we've been fortunate to get detailed explanations from several accomplished shapers concerning the art of shaping, pattern making, special edging techniques, welding etc., etc. All those posts have been helpful to us beginners!. Thank you!

Many of you are aware that I'm in the midst of a project called the McBearen Build. I have found that in my attempts to create a strong invisible seam between panels of aluminum I'm lacking in the knowledge to accomplish such from post-weld to completion. I've attempted several different procedures but none seem to be ideal.

Therefore, I'm requesting that anyone or all of you who have mastered these final, but critical, steps in the process to share the techniques (in detail) used to finish out a seam.

Ideally this would include a step-by-step descriptions, tools used and support photos illustrating each step within the process.

I realize that I'm asking a lot but I'm confident that the information will be helpful not only to me but to many other members as well.

Thanks in advance!

Dick Bear

[Dick Bear]

I can only assume that the 57 members who viewed this post between the time I posted it and the time of this reply were also interested in how to finish-off a seam like the masters.

Shortly after my original post I received a call from the Master of All Masters, Wray.

He explained that he has in the past posted information on the procedure he has found to be the most effective over his lifetime of metal shaping but that that information has always been lost in the deluge of collateral (related and unrelated) information that usually accompanies posts on MM.

During our phone conversation Wray went through the prep and procedure for me and I am passing my notes from that conversation on to all. I am acting solely as the messenger here and in no way believe that because the information came to me from the Master I am threfore one of them.

I (like you) will be practicing these techniques while finding it reassuring to know that what I am doing is in-line with the proven methods practiced by those who repeatedly produce professional results. Here are my notes:

Aluminum and Steel Seams and Finishing
(Wray S/Dick B conversation 4/11/06)

PREP:

- Cut weld filler rod from stock material
- Chamfer panel edges 1/2 the thickness of the sheet material
- Cut weather strip copper backing 1 1/2" in width
- Use "Red" label Tungsten rod 3/32" dia.
- Tungsten point: - Form a sharp point with a 5/16" bevel

TACK WELD PROCEDURE:

- Once panels are formed to hold a neutral position in perfect alignment
- Bevel each edge of panels to be joined
- Place copper strips on backside of seam
- Tack weld in 1 inch increments beginning in the middle of the seam
- As each tack is made watch to see if the ends of the panels begin to cross over one another.
If they do:
- Carefully grind-off the top dome of the tacks and using a hand held anvil on the back, tap the tack(s) until the panels re-align themselves.
- Continue tacking! watch for panel cross-over until entire seam is tacked in 1"� increments

FINAL WELD PROCEDURE:

- To concentrate heat, hold Tungsten tip as close to beveled seam as possible without coming in contact with molten filler material
- Weld in one inch lengths filling bevel trough with "proud"� just slightly above panel surfaces using traditional Tig welding technique
- Skip around seam to avoid building up heat too much in one area
- Lightly plannish any area that becomes distorted and continue in segments until entire seam is welded
- Carefully grind-off "proud"� were needed
- Plannish seam smooth with hammer or slapper

That's it! That's the Gospel According to Wray and I'm going to follow it to the letter.

For those of us who had no idea of the time one should expect to spend on a weld here is a shocker for ya! Wray figures one hour's time for each foot of normal weld. So, if your family is waiting on you to go to the mall, may I suggest that you wait to weld that seam at a later time!

Dick Bear

[Ernie Ferrucci]

Dick
I just spent 2 hours writing a post complete with pictures, step by step text, and I don't know what key I hit but the whole thing disappeared .
I'll try it again when I calm down as I am banging the key pretty hard right now.

[CCWKen]

All very good points and a good format. Glad I've been doing it right.

There is one thing I don't see though:

As each tack is made watch to see if the ends of the panels begin to cross over one another.
If they do:
- Carefully grind-off the top dome of the tacks and using a hand held anvil on the back, tap the tack(s) until the panels re-align themselves.
- Continue tacking… watch for panel cross-over until entire seam is tacked in 1� increments

I don't see the ends "crossing over" as much as I see them open up. I guess it depends on the panel shape or something. The procedure is the same though. I'm also glad to see the grinding before hammering on a weld. Too many folks try to hammer a fresh weld and ripple the seam.

Nice going Wray and Dick!

[Ernie Ferrucci]

Hi Dick
I see you got a good outline from Wray, that is of course great information. I will recreate my post but I will add it to a previous thread I started building a motorcycle tank: http://www.metalmeet.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3858
I did not go into fine detail on the welding and joint finishing in that thread. It will make that thread more informative and relates quite well to your questions. In the mean time there are photos in my gallery that I drew on to write the lost post.

[edwardd_]

Ernie,

I have done it on numerous occasions over the years. For things I know will be long, I create them off line and save them in a file. Sometimes it takes several days to complete. Gathering pictures, making corrections, etc.

Then when I am done, I post it.

HTH

Originally Posted by Ernie Ferrucci

Dick
I just spent 2 hours writing a post complete with pictures, step by step text, and I don't know what key I hit but the whole thing disappeared .
I'll try it again when I calm down as I am banging the key pretty hard right now.

[Ernie Ferrucci]

Hi David
Where do compose posts off line for future posting? Could you explain the process? I would like to try that for a lengthy post.
PS. I just saw your post here: http://www.metalmeet.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4846 about doing that, thanks.

[Wray Schelin]

Originally Posted by TheRodDoc

just wondering how the copper backing strip was held on to the metal?

Hi Richard,

I use padded long reach vise grips. If it is impossible to use a copper strip backup use back gas tape; which is an aluminum foil that has an adhesive on the edges and a fiberglass cloth center strip.

[Gene_Olson]

How about just taping the form fit copper strip on with al duct tape?

[Tisdelski]

thanks dick,
i believe that i have read every post on metalmeet and don`t think i`ve seen this subject covered in this detail.

gary