Cyclecars - What is a cyclecar?

Not a cyclekart..not even as good as one..and certainly not anything on what you guys are building...might be a good little side line for a shop to pump out a few of these every year?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...01287&rd=1

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[Tinman]

Maybe I should come out to Cal. and start something up.

[Dick Bear]

Didn't we know it would be just a matter of time before this would happen?

Stay in Ohio Tinman. Do the same thing from there if making and selling CC is your dream.

Dick Bear

Well, your margins go down rapidly when you start factoring in the cost of doing business (and living) in CA. The idea is to live and work someplace cheap and sell the product out where there is some money floating around. Still...I bet you would have no trouble selling one or two of your cars a year to finance a pretty nice vacation out West. I think the product would ahve to be a lot more focused on a particular car..like a sort of scale model you can drive of a Typo 35 Bugatti etc...and you would have to spend a lot of time reseaching to get it right. I think your price would go up based on how close you could come and how much detail you went into.

In general cyclekarts have not been for sale, but, that is just one take on it. When I started promoting this I felt that at the very least a car like this would be a great set piece in a shop (here's what we can do), and, if you are running a shop and have to pay the rent and a crew and there is not as much work, why not build a couple on spec...you should certainly be able to break even once you got the system down.
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[Dick Bear]

Bill,

Speaking of authenticity, did the Bugatti have that style of wheels? My information shows spokes. The ones on the ebay item look pretty contemporary but it may represent a different model than my references.

And did you notice the waves in the tail section? Not I at this point, but many others involved in this site could, I'm sure, produce a metal finish far better.

Dick Bear

[Tinman]

Ok I guess I'll stay right here in good old OHIO. I think I will research some of the other styles of racers and maybe plan to build one later on. We have an auction just in Auburn Ind. called the Auburn, Cord, Dusenberg festival and at the swap meet they sell all kinds of automobelia. I just bet I could make a killing there. Well it's a thought. Catch you guys later.

I didn't look at the pictures very long, but yes the daisy alloy wheels on the Type 35? were revolutionary at the time...and a very distinctive part of that car...brake drums were cast into the wheel as I remember with a steel liner. The later type 57's and 59's had wires...

I am always amazed that almost everything about cars was already invented and in some form of production before 1920, and a lot of it in the 19th century. Advances since are in materials and production techniques and closer tolerances, not to mention financing but genuine innovation like Honda's valving technology in the early sixties are rare. We have been refining ideas rather than inventing new ones for nearly 100 years....As I said ealier about the Cooper. Fat tires, wings, materials and corporate logos (plus more refined engines producing more power) are about all that distinquishes today's open wheel racer from the 60 year old plus Cooper FIII..with Colin Chapman's introduction of the space frame at about the same time. An amazing achievment for those post war Brits.
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[Dick Bear]

I'm amazed, not at the "daisy wheels" being authentic for the period, but at your knowledge for knowing it. That is unless you're just pulling my leg.

I'm also amazed that for someone who is such a student of pre and post war world auto maker's achievement, you seem to be reluctant to give credit, where due, for the achievements in engineering and design created since that period. I don't mean this to be argumentitive in any way. I just find it interseting that based upon what I've read, you seem pretty progressive in your own creative endeavours but in this one area you give the impression of holding-on to the past as if it is a sacred cow.

That seems to be a unique position for one whose own creative production is what I would consider contemporary in nature.

Well, I'd better stop or Wray will send me a caution about content. Sorry Wray, there really isn't any in here but I just had to follow up with these statements with Bill. I guess I should have used an email for this. I will next time!

Dick Bear

Oh, don't misunderstand...I am extremely impressed with modern technologies..almost magic. And, there is no getting around the fact that although they are "basically the same" in their design, cars today are far better than they ever were..as appliances anyway. I.m not a Luddite by any stretch.

But I do like to put things in context..for myself as much as anyone...Someday for instance I would llike to own and drive a 100 year old car...not a big deal really, but remarkable for a machine built that long ago don't you think? Also, there is a point after which working on cars is limited to people with advanced degrees in mechanical engineering or a lifetime of experience somewhere. As a result, how can you really take a deep interest in them?

What is genuinely new seem to me to be mostly in refining elements and making them faster, more reliable and easier/cheaper to produce. Those little tiny valves over those little tiny pistons in the F1 Honda's years ago, blew me away..and the technology lead directly to the emmisions beating Accord that put them on the map..(the car that Detroit said was impossible to build). That's why I always liked motorcycles..they seemed technologically ahead of cars for many years...at least accessable technology.

But, all that said, the internal combustion engine is far overdue to be replaced by something it would seem to me...And, as good as the cars are, there are some downsides..one is the huge complexity and expense of modern cars where there is no question of owner maintenance let alone a rebuild of any major components. Now you don't buy a car you buy a service agreement. If somethig goes wrong, like modern radios, no one fixes it, they replace it. Some say this is efficiency, but I can't help thinking it is very wasteful. Also, nothing you can do about it, but I think cars are too easy to drive and lull people into a sort of boredom which they fill with other activities..don't get me started on cell phoines. Believeme. when you get that cyclekart rolling you won't be on the phone or doing your nails! (Content Wray)

Yeah, this discussion should move over to that other catch all formum Wray has set up but I don't know how to reply on the fly...Lets continue the discussion on another wave length and let these cyclekarters get on with it...
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How about continuing the thread in

Silly debates in the craft of sheetmetal shaping

Seem to be zero posts in this incredibly important area...Is there nothing silly in metalshaping?! Get a life guys...
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