Did i spend to much on my VFD

[johnny rocket]

I recently had a electrician purchase and install a vfd on my pullmax p-7 because i have no clue on this stuff even after doin some homework on it . I told him it just has to run 220 single phase to 220 three phase and have variable speed. I know there are cheaper vfd's out there but how bad did i get raked . I think he sold me a Cadillac of vfd's it is a Schneider electric model ATV12HU22M2 3 HP for $395. He said he would us this one because there are technicians locally for them, which is nice if i have any problems down the road. Give me your opinions, did i waste my money?

[Rick (madera)]

Rule of thumb on pricing is about $100 per Horse Power.
it also depends on the NEMA rating.(water proof)
Plus an electrian to wire it up.
I would think it was a fair price
$300 for 3 hp
$ 95 to wire it
______
$395 :)

[johnny rocket]

paid
$165 labor
$143 for a dam box to put it in CRAZY!!!!!
$395 vfd

[johnny rocket]

but maybe considering i only paid $800 dollars for a p-7 with both tool holders, fence, and small amount of tooling and delivered to my shop, im still doing good on it.

[Tony Sanchez]

---Over all sounds like you came out with the best end of the deal.
---Tony

[Carbuilder]

I by my vfd from automation direct . There tec service is top notch & here so I can understand them. They will walk you thru step by step on set up & setting the parameters. I have 3 machines using there stuff & 1 or 2 more coming in the future.

[oldgoaly]

My last VFD purchase was from Factorymation, a 3hp with cooling fan was right at 200$ w/shipping. We are metalshapers, buy a box????
You got it going for less than 2 grand.... sounds like a pretty good deal. Don't know much about Schnieder, where is it made? I have 2 Teco/westinghouse from factorymation they are made in Tiawan. I have others to add to the confusion:rolleyes: some USA, some Japan. all seem to work, just slight differences in set up and programing.

[Rick (madera)]

paid
$165 labor
$143 for a dam box to put it in CRAZY!!!!!
$395 vfd

ouch!:cool:
But at least it is working now :)

[oldgoaly]

one thing I see that I had that you may want to do it the "on/off" button was near the front of machine so easy to reach.
http://www.metalmeet.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=210&pictureid=3028

[Doug98105]

If the question is, was $700 a good price to have someone supply and install a 3hp VFD? Assuming he did it per code it might not have been a bad price. When you pay list price things are expensive, if it's like the Schneider control circuits I've bought it is the Cadillac (or, I should say priced like it is).

If the question is, could I have done it myself cheaper? The answer is yes.

Right now I'm looking at around $1750 for a 5hp VFD. Only because it's a Baldor which I need to match up to the motor I'm using. You don't find this type VFD and the connection cabling at the discounters.

[johnny rocket]

the vfd has sensorless flux vector control, which if i understand it right I don't lose motor torque at low rpm

[johnny rocket]

one thing I see that I had that you may want to do it the "on/off" button was near the front of machine so easy to reach.
http://www.metalmeet.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=210&pictureid=3028
this is a old pic, all electrical boxes have been removed except the one by the motor and once vfd is on then on/off is on the foot pedal

[Rick (madera)]

Right now I'm looking at around $1750 for a 5hp VFD. Only because it's a Baldor which I need to match up to the motor I'm using. You don't find this type VFD and the connection cabling at the discounters


I'm confussed!:confused: you don't need to match up the VFD with the motor.
the only thing you have to make sure is that it is the right HP and voltage.
the motor doesn't care what the make of the VFD is, votage is voltage!

connection cabling


you have 3 wires plus a ground out and 3 wires and a ground in:cool:

[oldgoaly]

Rick,
Look out for amps! My other fm50 Teco is on a 3 hp Baldor a Simpson sand muller. The Teco FM50 is rated for 10.5 amps, Baldor motor motor is 11.3 (11.something less than 5) If I overfill the sand muller the Teco FM50 will shut down with an error code of "OL" Now one of us putting a P7 under full load and stalling out the motor??? not likely I had one (P7) for 12-13 years and never thought I was even close to making the motor bogg down.
Johnny, vector control is better according to what I have read and is more expensive a 3hp 1ph input is 299$ Now what are you gonna make with the P7??? Happy Holidays! tt;)

[Doug98105]

I'm confussed!:confused: you don't need to match up the VFD with the motor.
the only thing you have to make sure is that it is the right HP and voltage.
the motor doesn't care what the make of the VFD is, votage is voltage!


you have 3 wires plus a ground out and 3 wires and a ground in:cool:


This is a flux vector VFD. It connects to a Baldor motor with an encoder to monitor the motor's armature position. It's the "C" axis, spindle of a lathe. These type setups have to be tuned to the application so the chance of problems is less if you match everything from the same manufacturer.

One of the connection cables is $350.

I was using this as an example that all VFD's are not low cost and available through discount sellers. I believe the Schneider VFD the OP got may be a higher quality unit than sold by discounters.

Doug

[johnny rocket]

That is right doug18105 we are on the same page. like i said before i knew their was cheaper vfd's out their and i have a factorymation catalog but for the most part its all over my head. I turned the electrician loose on it because he duse $30,000 dollars a year worth of business a year selling and installing vfd on industrial and agriculture applications. There is a good chance he has a clue, and me being a firm believer in you get what you pay for, that is what i went with. But was it to much vfd for my money I just wanted some opinions on it.

another thing i went by was if you look on clay cooks site they refurbish pullmax machines with vector drives and vector duty motors. Now i don't know if you need a vector duty motor to take advantage of that on the vfd. This is why i hire it done because when i did my homework it just got more confusing. Or maybe I make it harder then it is:confused:

[ESjaavik]

The VFD's you get new today have constant torque from labelled (on motor) RPM and down. Going higher than labelled RPM they have constant HP.

I can't say if your price is right, but here the price for your electricians time would not buy you one hour!

It seems you got an electrician who actually know how to program a VFD. Most of tehm would just think: "VF what?". It does need to be programmed for your motor if you want it to perform at its best and protect your motor too.

Relax, I think you should have a good setup protecting your investment in VFD and motor if the guy have experience setting these things up. They give you variable speed along with motor protection and the possibility to place your on/off/direction and speed control wherever you like it. Just extend the cables. They carry low (safe) voltage and very little current.

[DYCE]

but maybe considering i only paid $800 dollars for a p-7 with both tool holders, fence, and small amount of tooling and delivered to my shop, im still doing good on it.

Yeh $800.00+$395.00=you suck.......
Yeh your doing good right under my nose:lol:
Where did this pullmax come from?

[johnny rocket]

Dyce this is the pullmax that came out of luverne minnesota at hills stainless steel, I think i had talk to you about it.

[Richard K]

paid
$165 labor
$143 for a dam box to put it in CRAZY!!!!!
$395 vfd

re: the $143 box.

Most of the VFDs that people are buying from automation direct and other sources are required to be placed inside a NEMA enclosure. Your electrician did the proper job by doing so. The VFDs we often see have connections top and bottom for in and out voltages that are not enclosed. you (or anyone) can accidently contact the screws on the lugs inside the plastic sleeve, THEY ARE OPEN!

We do things and they work. That does not make it the right way. Your electrician followed Natl Elec and NEMA codes. Can't fault anyone for doing the job right.

We talk every day about the poor quality work done by some. The electrician did GOOD quality work.

[DYCE]

Dyce this is the pullmax that came out of luverne minnesota at hills stainless steel, I think i had talk to you about it.

That's what I thought. One came out of the John Morrell plant a little while back. I keep wondering where the next one will be found.

[johnny rocket]

re: the $143 box.

Most of the VFDs that people are buying from automation direct and other sources are required to be placed inside a NEMA enclosure. Your electrician did the proper job by doing so. The VFDs we often see have connections top and bottom for in and out voltages that are not enclosed. you (or anyone) can accidently contact the screws on the lugs inside the plastic sleeve, THEY ARE OPEN!

We do things and they work. That does not make it the right way. Your electrician followed Natl Elec and NEMA codes. Can't fault anyone for doing the job right.

We talk every day about the poor quality work done by some. The electrician did GOOD quality work.


very well said

[johnny rocket]

That's what I thought. One came out of the John Morrell plant a little while back. I keep wondering where the next one will be found.


Im going to guess that is the p-5 at kevins shop IIsly

I have some info on maybe another machine in the area, :eek:

and no not twisted choppers :p

[DYCE]

Yep Kevin. It was well tooled, it even had the lower half of the pullmax louver dies with it. I couldn't find the upper half, but that can be made easy enough. I have my Baker so I really don't need a pullmax, but I'd like the extra adjustments, and throat height.

[CARS]

Don't keep it a secret! Luverne is only an hour away :cool:

[johnny rocket]

Don't keep it a secret! Luverne is only an hour away :cool:
That is to far away to drag a big heavy piece of scrap iron home anyway. :lol:

plus high price of gas and all the room it would take up in your shop.

I cant see why anyone would want those things.:lol:


just messing with you!